amuck-landowner

BuyVM Legal Defense Fund? LOL

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hellogoodbye

New Member
All those providers coming out of the woodwork to join in just left me shaking my head. They're so intent on their frenzied witchhunt that they don't even care about anything else, like the impression they're leaving on third parties - especially potential or existing clients - any longer. It's like they've taken on some sort of "if we're going down, we're dragging you with us" mentality. Either that or it's a lame deflection trick to divert people's attentions away from the recent CC/HVH mess, which isn't exactly working and the only true advantage they've gained out of this mess is the ability to change the title to sound as sensational and damaging as possible for Google to pick up. (Speaking of which, I do like how quickly the admins jumped in to change the title once again-- very nice and misleading, cannot praise them enough. /sarcasm)

tl;dr -- My impression of that entire thread is pretty much summed up by this Pirahna gif, especially once CVPS, 123Systems and the LET admins jumped in the fray:

tumblr_l9n63fKX4T1qze5g2o1_500.gif
 

CVPS_Chris

New Member
Verified Provider
Hey Fabozzi, how come you can't even get in the top 5 results for the quarterly provider polls? Doesn't your best friend own the place! :p

Someone is butthurt and jealous because they found a company that is not putting 300 VPSes on an e3 with 32GB of RAM like they were...

The slabbing stuff isn't really 'new', either. The basement/office/whatever thing is new to me, but hey, I didn't see anyone complaining about performance...
Manndude, you should probably rethink what you just posted. The reason CVPS name is not what it used to be is because of people like Fran and Dustin that run around posting false information. Because they are liked in the community people start to believe them even though the information is false.


Fran does it much worse. He has 20 nodes across 5 servers in Buffalo, again think before you speak.

The reason no one complained is because its false, there was no servers in Batavia its all a lie hes caught in and cant explain his way out of. I find it funny that BuyVM is such a small operation but acts like they are so big. They have around 25-30 servers total at both locations.
 

tchen

New Member
We found out interesting facts with these things, but in the long run, nobody cares,including most of their customers. All the bashing against me calling me racist, even muslim gipsy had 0 effect on cancellations, at least I dont recall seeing any that says it was because of my opinions.
I can't talk for anyone else but all the provider bashing going around has actually had an effect on my purchasing plans.  For not the very reason you may think but the opposite.  Any provider that's jumping in picking fights and mudslinging automatically notches themselves down in my books.  That went for you (yes, despite you protesting it not being related to Prometeus - you still are the person I deal with there), Aldryic and even Chris.  Ironically, the more each of you mud sling the worse it becomes for your own side.

At this moment, I'm leaning back to paying a helleva lot more on AWS or even take a known crap quantity like Digital Ocean just because its less drama.  Whether there is a real risk of your personal behaviours impacting your technical professionalism remains to be seen but there's obviously a strong lack of basic business filtering being shown.  Defending and correcting is fine, but dishing it back out for revenge or deterrence is not.

Mudslinging might work as a tactic in politics because there's no one else to vote for.  But given that its 2014, there's definitely a lot of alternatives in hosting so it might not be the wisest move.  Again, that's just me.  I might not even be part of your target demographic.  2c.

P.S. I don't have to like you to do business with you.  But I do have to be able to trust you.
 
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raindog308

vpsBoard Premium Member
Moderator
... $7 price ceiling ....

and guess what, in the United States, I am nearly certain that constitutes PRICE FIXING.  It's against the law.
No, I don't think it does.

First, price fixing is usually about raising prices - a bunch of vendors get together and say "we agree not to sell for less than $20".  That would harm consumers.

Here, you have a third party (yes, just a minute on that) who says "I'm only going to list offers that are $7 or less".  That is not price fixing.  It'd be like if I set up a car review site and said I'd only review cars that sold for less than $15,000 and told manufacturers they could only advertise cars for less than $15,000.  No one would say "and therefore we can sue Ford".

Vendors can still sell for more or less in the marketplace, advertise wherever they want, etc.  LEB/LET is just a review site with a forum.

I'm aware that CC owns LET, but the LET policies were in place pre-CC, and more importantly, CC does not control all the providers who advertise there.
 

nunim

VPS Junkie
No. It's because you're an arrogant asshole.
Well this is probably part of it, but I'd say it also has something to do with multiple database compromises, poor node performance and IPv6 coming soon forever..

Censoring only the dates is certainly an odd tactics, names and emails maybe but dates? 

I thought the ticket Chris posted was in relation to the SolusVM "hack" that we never heard anything else about and was denied by Solus (although that doesn't mean a whole lot either).

[Edit]  I'm not a BuyVM fanboy, for a multitude of reasons, including their billing policies, but I'd probably give BuyVM a try before ever touching a CVPS again.
 
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MitchellRobert

New Member
How can Solus possibly sue BuyVM? That makes no sense:

1. Making a replacement software isn't illegal. Sure you can claim and hope they decoded your PHP 101 quality code and changed it, but really, using Solus code is the last thing you should do. (in clear language: it's obfuscated, so it will take time to decode, not to mention a first year PHP student writes better PHP than this train wreck known as "SolusVM")

2. Solus, civil lawsuits cost money, a lot of money. Now, where would you get enough money from to pay that because the complainer has to pay it initially, and I'm pretty damn sure you'd lose it unless the US law suddenly changes into something... You get the idea, keep on dreaming.
 
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MartinD

Retired Staff
Verified Provider
Retired Staff
I think you've missed the point of this thread completely and utterly. Spectacularly, even.
 

drmike

100% Tier-1 Gogent
 I'd probably give BuyVM a try before ever touching a CVPS again.
Problem is, as you probably noticed, avoiding CC is like avoiding the common cold if you are paying attention.  Who knows what "investments" he/they have in other providers.

That's why I've advocated entirely avoiding CC and those who offer from their network.  Sucks for the honest providers, but like any other MLM the downstream makes daddy on top money.

I'm hoping the boys in Buffalo take note of the messes and change course entirely.  Less of the games, deception, etc.  more focus on their business and competing like normal businesses.   Same applies to BuyVM.  I've never liked the provider attacks, even if I like the provider more or less so.

Did someone use my transparent word over there?   Yeah... Uhhhmmm..  Maybe I'll write ya'all a love letter about the topic.
 

raindog308

vpsBoard Premium Member
Moderator
How can Solus possibly sue BuyVM? That makes no sense:
The only possible grounds would be:

  1. Copyright.  But Solus is ioncube'd and they'd have to prove code theft, which is virtually impossible in this case.
  2. Patents.  But I doubt Solus has any patents on a VPS control panel.
  3. Trademark.  But BuyVM is not calling it "Stallion" and the look/feel is quite different
  4. Trade dress/etc. - but Solus could never demonstrated that a potential customer would confuse the two.  BuyVM doesn't even sell Stallion.
  5. Trade Secret - which would require demonstrating that it was stolen.  I doubt one could even be postulated - it's a web-based application that makes calls to other vendors' APIs.
You can't sue just because someone else has the same idea as you or says "I can make the same thing, only better".
 

nunim

VPS Junkie
Problem is, as you probably noticed, avoiding CC is like avoiding the common cold if you are paying attention.  Who knows what "investments" he/they have in other providers.......
That's not an issue for me, A. I only purchase VPS(es??)  that come with Native IPv6, B. my network is developed enough that I already have a solid provider in all locations that CC offers, aside from Chicago, still waiting on that one.
 
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CVPS_Chris

New Member
Verified Provider
@drmike can you please explain to me other than me hiding BuffaloVPS years ago to be double posted, and the whole HVH thing ( which was news to me ), what is it that you have against myself and/or ColoCrossing?

If you take a look at the service etc, ColoCrossing is actually your best choice over many others as far as uptime, network, and quality. Just because you have something against Jon or myself as a person doesnt discount the actual service being provided. Same goes with CVPS, the service we offer is actually much better than most of the hosts out there. You even said it yourself, and there is proof that our service is good, just go and look at the last LEB posting.

Its never made much sense to me where all the hate has come from. Please explain and finally clear it all up.
 

Francisco

Company Lube
Verified Provider
Fran already admitted in LET thread that he took the code.
The only code we used was their web interface and that was available for public download for the sake of creating new skins. You didn't even have to be a paying customer to get it back in the day. I don't know if that's

the case in their bootstrap setup but I know it was during their SMARTY days.

There was countless people that took part in the stallion 2 beta and even in the initial stallion 1 testing. I don't think you still quite understand how ioncubed code works. You can't just go visit a site and it gives you some perfect dump of the code. Someone did just that with solus a few months ago and it showed huge, massive, hunks that were simply not there.

EDIT - Expanding on a thought

Francisco
 
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drmike

100% Tier-1 Gogent
First, price fixing is usually about raising prices - a bunch of vendors get together and say "we agree not to sell for less than $20".  That would harm consumers.

Here, you have a third party (yes, just a minute on that) who says "I'm only going to list offers that are $7 or less".  That is not price fixing.  It'd be like if I set up a car review site and said I'd only review cars that sold for less than $15,000 and told manufacturers they could only advertise cars for less than $15,000.  No one would say "and therefore we can sue Ford".

Vendors can still sell for more or less in the marketplace, advertise wherever they want, etc.  LEB/LET is just a review site with a forum.

I'm aware that CC owns LET, but the LET policies were in place pre-CC, and more importantly, CC does not control all the providers who advertise there.
Price fixing is an interesting topic and one that will probably be discussed more in coming months.

By limiting the price to $7 it by default limits the available pool of companies who can or will sell at such a price.  Now couple that with a provider CC owning the place who funds/supplies to a great number of the companies... and bundle their "friend's" company which has too close ties and that company's propensity towards outlandish and unsustainable market disruptors --- 2GB @ $7, now 2GB $2~...  and the choice to  publish many offers (disproportional number I argue) that directly benefit them (customers or investment interest).

Price fixing is an agreement between participants on the same side in a market to buy or sell a product, service, or commodity only at a fixed price, or maintain the market conditions such that the price is maintained at a given level by controlling supply and demand.

The intent of price fixing may be to push the price of a product as high as possible, leading to profits for all sellers but may also have the goal to fix, peg, discount, or stabilize prices. The defining characteristic of price fixing is any agreement regarding price, whether expressed or implied.


Price fixing requires a conspiracy between sellers or buyers.
^--- sounds umm in multiple places applicable.

I'm aware that CC owns LET, but the LET policies were in place pre-CC,
That's funny sort of (good point BTW).  Here's the deal, LET and LEB fail to disclose their ownership to the public on said sites.  Maybe I am blind.  I don't see ToS, Privacy policy, About Us, etc.  So very bad to start with.  Again, like the HVH debacle, the only way to know about the ownership is to linger and read or make mistake of spending money and note who ate your money.  Deceptive.

Just because policies pre-date their acquisition doesn't make those policies legitimate.  In fact the former owner was Australian, and such price capping/fixing might have been illegal under law in Australia.  But you have to remember, LET/LEB was a community and NOT-FOR-PROFIT, so while such may have been illegal both the size of the site then (smaller) and non-commercial operation made it an uninteresting target.

Contrast that to the whole takeover, deceptive BS,  and their clear intentional milking of the market as a FOR PROFIT investment.  FOR PROFIT and manipulating the manipulated capped marketplace.  Operating in New York State (which has gone after price fixers) in the United States (which goes after price fixer).

Place your bets...
 

CVPS_Chris

New Member
Verified Provider
@hellogoodbye, it wasn't with quotations. He went back and later added that ( changing his story ). Doesnt matter though, he deserves what he has coming to him.
 

raindog308

vpsBoard Premium Member
Moderator
Fran already admitted in LET thread that he took the code.
No he didn't.

Are you familiar with quotation marks, sarcasm, etc.?

"you wouldn't be able to have an intellectual conversation with me. Its simple, you are not smart enough."

  -- CVPS_Chris
 
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