# Google: "Gmail users shouldn't expect email privacy"



## drmike (Aug 14, 2013)

Google: Gmail users shouldn't expect email privacy

Critics call revelation 'a stunning admission' as Google makes claim in court filing in attempt to head off class action lawsuit.

Full story: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/aug/14/google-gmail-users-privacy-email-lawsuit

The court filing legal brief: http://www.scribd.com/doc/160134104/Google-Motion-to-Dismiss-061313


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## Zach (Aug 14, 2013)

Well I guess it's time to move away then.  Far away.


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## Slownode (Aug 14, 2013)

Ya Google gives full read access to it's databases and archives to the gov so anything Google knows, which is a lot, they know.


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## stim (Aug 14, 2013)

Is it really a surprise?


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## Aldryic C'boas (Aug 14, 2013)

And this is why I've been moving all of my data off of any server which I don't solely administrate.


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## jarland (Aug 14, 2013)

I mean I never really did. I just always thought they cared more about it than they do. It's nice to know the score, that's all.


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## wdq (Aug 14, 2013)

Google's primary source of revenue is selling advertisements. It's not surprising that they aren't all that concerned about privacy.


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## notFound (Aug 14, 2013)

Well I'm not surprised at all, infact I expect this to happen a few more services people use regularly. We all knew it was going on anyway. Now they're just being open about it.


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## KuJoe (Aug 14, 2013)

Anybody who expects Google (whose main business is in advertising) to be private is naive at best. Seriously, that's as bad as signing up for "free offers" on a random pop-up and expecting your e-mail not to be sold and used for spam.

I commend Google for being honest, it's a rare trait in large corporations these days.

No person should ever assume any privacy on the internet without taking an active role in creating and maintaining that privacy. The internet by nature is an open, public form of communication and it is up to the user to create their own privacy. Placing blame on any company or person other than oneself for lack of privacy is just ignorant. At the very least, reviewing privacy policies should be done prior to signing up or using any service online.


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## sleddog (Aug 14, 2013)

Umm, which part of this is news? I though it was common knowledge.


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## clarity (Aug 14, 2013)

It also appears that people are taking this completely out of context.


http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/14/4621474/yes-gmail-users-have-an-expectation-of-privacy


The whole section quoted was referring to 3rd parties sending email to GMail accounts.


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## concerto49 (Aug 14, 2013)

Not like Vole is better with Outlook.


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## Steve (Aug 14, 2013)

dclardy said:


> It also appears that people are taking this completely out of context.
> 
> http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/14/4621474/yes-gmail-users-have-an-expectation-of-privacy
> 
> ...


What! Get your facts, reality and logic out of here!


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## perennate (Aug 14, 2013)

dclardy said:


> It also appears that people are taking this completely out of context.
> 
> http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/14/4621474/yes-gmail-users-have-an-expectation-of-privacy
> 
> ...


So? Google still sucks!


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## Wintereise (Aug 14, 2013)

What's with all this circlejerking? I mean come on, how is this a surprise?

(And I'm aware of the Context)

If you don't like it, set up your own mail and use that -- pretty simple.


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## rm_ (Aug 15, 2013)

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/aug/14/google-gmail-users-privacy-email-lawsuit



> *Simpson*, a long-term Google critic, said: "Google's brief uses a wrong-headed analogy; sending an email is like giving a letter to the Post Office. I expect the Post Office to deliver the letter based on the address written on the envelope. I don't expect the mail carrier to open my letter and read it.


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## drmike (Aug 15, 2013)

KuJoe said:


> I commend Google for being honest, it's a rare trait in large corporations these days.


Google isn't being honest.  

Google is cornered in a pending class action lawsuit that appears to have them forced to disclose their bad behavior.

I haven't read the brief yet (lack of time right now).

Remember a year or three ago when Google created this big PR site 'Which country subpoenas' info from Google site?  --- along with vague nature of the requests from governments.   They didn't anywhere in there say they pipe to / have built in taps for NSA and other intelligence agencies... Now did they?  Nopers.  We know better now.

Google is the worlds greatest deceiver.  Before the dust settles, folks will see, they are just black ops military industrial complex.  DARPA 2.0.  Government couldn't direct tap and trace everyone, some of us already fought that in the early to mid 1990s.  So government control freaks funneled money and deals to "private" coprorations that do way more tracking and tracing than gov ever could dream of.

Do we not remember a Google VP being involved in insurrection and overthrow in Egypt?  That's exactly what the CIA engages in.  DARPA or CIA, there isn't any real difference.   Same general deception, lack of accountability and filthy misdeeds.  

Face it, Google has been ogling


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## wlanboy (Aug 15, 2013)

Aldryic C said:


> And this is why I've been moving all of my data off of any server which I don't solely administrate.


Me too. Every service provided for free has some drawbacks.



wdq said:


> Google's primary source of revenue is selling advertisements. It's not surprising that they aren't all that concerned about privacy.


Yup - personalized ads.



KuJoe said:


> Anybody who expects Google (whose main business is in advertising) to be private is naive at best. Seriously, that's as bad as signing up for "free offers" on a random pop-up and expecting your e-mail not to be sold and used for spam.
> 
> I commend Google for being honest, it's a rare trait in large corporations these days.


Simply true. I don't understand the hysteria about this. Looks like a lot of people just started to think about how a free service with million of users can be privately financed.

Our current generation did not have to fight for anything. Just collecting the fruits of the last generation's work.

Because we do not care we are loosing a lot of rights. In this case our privacy to save one buck a month.

But we can talk about elections too. Anybody doing work for a political party? Or at least go to the polls/elections?


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## concerto49 (Aug 15, 2013)

Maybe stop using google search, blogspot, android phones etc too? same result.


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## rm_ (Aug 15, 2013)

concerto49 said:


> Maybe stop using google search, blogspot, android phones etc too? same result.


Not sure what's your point here, but privacy-conscious people *are* indeed migrating away from Google services in general.


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## concerto49 (Aug 15, 2013)

rm_ said:


> Not sure what's your point here, but privacy-conscious people *are* indeed migrating away from Google services in general.


Just reminding everyone that it's not just gmail!


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## D. Strout (Aug 15, 2013)

Three words: I don't care. Google (or my family, or my friends, or whoever) can read all my e-mails and searches for all I care. If I knew that I had been assigned a particular employee at Google whose job it was to read all content I ever received or sent through their services, the only reason I would be disappointed is that I would be making someone's life very boring. But that's not the case, and in fact that sentence about "not expecting privacy" refers only to the automated systems that "read" (more like "parse") your e-mails to generate ads. And I'm fine with ads, they make the world go 'round and I don't even use adblock. Tracking for personalized ads? Good! I like seeing Newegg products in my peripheral on Youtube.

Bottom line: Gmail is an excellent service that makes my life much less of a headache. If they have automated programs that parse my e-mails to make ads to pay for the people who make it better day by day, I'm fine with that. And I'm not going to enter in to this whole "Google is a government/secret service/NSA shell" conspiracy. They may hand over some information because they're required to by law, but I bet they don't like it any more than we do. Go after the government, not Google.


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## Wintereise (Aug 15, 2013)

^ Same, never bothered, don't see myself bothering anytime soon either.


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## Magiobiwan (Aug 15, 2013)

Same with me. I really don't give a damn. Read my emails if you'd like. You won't find much interesting.


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## kunnu (Aug 15, 2013)

One day they will start selling private details on google store


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## drmike (Aug 15, 2013)

It's not about your boring life as per your email messages.

It is about who is speaking to you, who they speak to, what the nature of things is and long term relationships these control nuts are keeping the details of.

Content matching ads, no I couldn't care less about in the big picture.  Profile building and sharing that info readily with government and inevitably insurance, risk assessment, etc.   well that's medieval torture.


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## eva2000 (Aug 15, 2013)

If folks are concerned just use Gmail via https://www.sendinc.com/


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## drmike (Aug 15, 2013)

Sendinc.com looks mighty interesting.   Lots of use limitations/caps, but good conceptually.


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## eva2000 (Aug 16, 2013)

Been using Sendinc for 2+ yrs mainly for client server work and passwords etc. Much easier for normal folks to understand sendinc then trying to explain to them how to setup and configure openpgp keys and encryption on their windows/mac computers heh


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## xCubex (Aug 16, 2013)

There stupid, of course they want privacy, whether its bad content or good content, somethings are personal, i guess like others say, time to move away from them


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## mitgib (Aug 16, 2013)

Aldryic C said:


> And this is why I've been moving all of my data off of any server which I don't solely administrate.


Hmm, didn't I say this years ago around the meeting hole?  Never use anything you do not have root too.


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## kunnu (Aug 17, 2013)

What is Solution?

- It is possible to copy your email from gmail to your desktop then remove all emails?(secure option?)

- Which email provider respect your privacy?


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## wdq (Aug 17, 2013)

kunnu said:


> What is Solution?
> 
> - It is possible to copy your email from gmail to your desktop then remove all emails?(secure option?)
> 
> - Which email provider respect your privacy?


This tutorial is a good one on how to copy your Gmail emails to another provider: http://www.twistermc.com/27915/move-gmail-to-gmail/


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## 365Networks (Aug 17, 2013)

SendInc sure does look interesting! Thanks for that.

Sadly most data goes over US lines and communications so it is quite hard to fully encrypt everything and hide it from the 'big bad NSA!'


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