# Advice for a new host...



## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

Hello,

 

NOTE: My site may still be down, I was moving servers but intodns.com seems to show it is up & I can see it. I just wanted to state this before I go into anything. ALSO, I am not trying to advertise my site. I am simply asking for advice. THANK YOU!

 

http://southhost.net

 

Is my website. I have a few questions being a new hosting provider...

 

1) Do you believe my plans are reasonable? No, I will not remove my free plans until I have quite a few clients.

 

2) What do you think of me redirecting people to my forum to register and pay for the plan?

I am planning to be moving IP.Nexus (http://invisionpower.com) from my forum to my hosting site with IPS4 as long as they give us that option. If they don't, I will make other arrangements. I'd just rather not pay $15/mo for WHMCS when I have a fully licensed (legally I might add) IP.Nexus that can process payments and pay for hosting just fine.

BUT I am also thinking about just using xenforo but only if I can sell my IPB license.

 

3) What do you think about my layout in general? I feel like since it is from themeforest.com it is overused. Someone showed me 2 hosting sites that use it and I'm sure there are more. I purchased another theme from there (that had little comments but it seems like it would be for a company whom is bigger than I am right now)

NOTE: there is supposed to be a rotation in that big area with the background (if you don't see it) but it doesn't like to show. Lol I'm working with the designer on that... or at least waiting for a response regarding it.

 

4) Do you think it would be an issue if I do not include an address on my website? Do you think it is any less professional?

I don't have a business address yet but I was thinking about buying a PO Box.. but until I do I wouldn't have one.

 

5) I'm using reseller hosting right now. When I do go purchase VPS hosting, what would you recommend I purchase? I'm seeing that people tend to like Xen and I plan to have cPanel... but I don't know linux commands though I learn fast so managing my own server shouldn't be a problem. I'm just not wanting to spend $100/mo when I first get the server (if I don't have to) so, I'm not 100% sure.

I may be able to work something out with my host where he gives me some hosting for free because I'm actually on his support staff... (http://drivehosting.org/) BUT I want to make sure it would be a good deal for a starter host.

 

6) Would you choose my hosting if you saw it coming from google?

Why or why not? DETAILS DETAILS DETAILS please. I would rather not have to ask you for more details.

 

7) Got any other advice?

 

To give you some background on me... I've been hosting since I started with websites. I love it! I love helping people learn how to code (hence my forum) and that is what I am going to school for.  I am only 21 years old so I am getting started at this pretty young. I am currently the only person working on my hosting site but I know a lot about everything and have owned managed VPS and dedicated servers before.


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

Your arrogance speaks volumes. If you ask for help, take your hat off. Don't come laying down the law telling people what you will and will not do.


Also, "I know a lot about everything" is a very, very dangerous thing to say round these parts especially when a few lines before you throw in this baby:


"but I don't know linux commands though I learn fast so managing my own server shouldn't be a problem."


Not sure how you run a hosting business when you have no clue about cli.


Welcome, anyway. You'll learn quickly no doubt.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> Your arrogance speaks volumes. If you ask for help, take your hat off. Don't come laying down the law telling people what you will and will not do.
> 
> 
> Also, "I know a lot about everything" is a very, very dangerous thing to say round these parts
> ...


Arrogance? I'm not arrogant and I don't appreciate being called that.

1) If I was arrogant 99% chance I would not have posted this because "My site is the best!"

2) I never said "I know a lot about everything".

3) Idk where I said what I would do and what I would not do.

Before you go calling people names, actually get to know them first. Asshole.


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

Thanks for making my point so well


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## mojeda (Jul 28, 2014)

Your website is in "maintenance" mode so I'm not sure how we are supposed to comment on your plans as well as layout.

IP.Nexus does not have an automation module for solusvm or the likes, as far as I know, which means everything will be manual.

If you cannot afford the upfront cost of a real vps node, or don't know how to CLI, you are in the wrong business.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> Thanks for making my point so well


Do you know how to read? Seriously.

Worst thing I've said in this thread is "Asshole".

I was asking for advice and you didn't even give me any. You just called me names. Where is your advice?


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

mojeda said:


> Your website is in "maintenance" mode so I'm not sure how we are supposed to comment on your plans as well as layout.
> 
> IP.Nexus does not have an automation module for solusvm or the likes, as far as I know, which means everything will be manual.
> 
> If you cannot afford the upfront cost of a real vps node, or know how to CLI, you are in the wrong business.


Fixed.

I've done everything Manually either way. So, i'm good with that.

CLL what is that?

Idk why you say that. I know a lot about helping people as far as the hosting goes. I'll learn CLL or whatever in time.


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> CLL what is that?
> 
> 
> Idk why you say that. I know a lot about helping people as far as the hosting goes. I'll learn CLL or whatever in time.


See?


Are you trolling or what? @Aldryic, we need you in here.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> See?
> 
> 
> Are you trolling or what? @Aldryic, we need you in here.


i'm not trolling. I'm trying to get help. You aren't HELPING. If you don't want to help GO AWAY.


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

I am helping. I'm helping you realise you don't posses even the most basic of skill sets to contemplate doing this.


Also, your current employer should be quite embarrassed a member of 'staff' is openly admitting to all of this in public.


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

CLI? Command Line Interface?????? Do you know what that is?


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> I am helping. I'm helping you realise you don't posses even the most basic of skill sets to contemplate doing this.
> 
> 
> Also, your current employer should be quite embarrassed a member of 'staff' is openly admitting to all of this in public.


He knows less than me when it comes to coding. It is very sad actually.

What skills would those be?

Just because I don't know as much as you do doesn't mean I can't manage my own VPS and such.

I know more than you think but you aren't giving me a chance to explain myself.

You are judging a book by its cover.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

Mun said:


> CLI? Command Line Interface?????? Do you know what that is?


I know what that is. I didn't know that it had an acronym though.


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

How do you install apache on debian or other deb based systems?


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## mojeda (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> I know what that is. I didn't know that it had an acronym though.


If you didn't know it was an acronym, then how can you know what that is???


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

How can you manage a VM if you have no idea what the CLI is? And you want to run a hosting company?!


Seriously, mtwiscool knows more than you seem to and that is not a good thing...!


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

Mun said:


> How do you install apache on debian or other deb based systems?


There are enough tutorials online for me to learn within a matter of an hour. I know how to use SSH and have installed Zamfoo before. Pretty easy. I know basic linux commands so building on that is easy.



mojeda said:


> If you didn't know it had an acronym then how can you know what that is???


Because I know what the command line interface is. it is where you put the commands to write files or change permissions or install products like Zamfoo.


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## MartinD (Jul 28, 2014)

I don't even know where to go with this now. A genuine, straight up GoogleHost.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> How can you manage a VM if you have no idea what the CLI is? And you want to run a hosting company?!
> 
> 
> Seriously, mtwiscool knows more than you seem to and that is not a good thing...!


I know what CLI is now, you didn't tell me it was an acronym for something and what that freaking acronym was.

You know what. If you guys are just going to make fun of me/bring me down/tell me I am an idiot instead of doing what this forum says and bring me up and give me FUCKING ADVICE. Delete my account and this post and all of my other posts. I don't need to be apart of a community like this. Fucking assholes.


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> There are enough tutorials online for me to learn within a matter of an hour. I know how to use SSH and have installed Zamfoo before. Pretty easy. I know basic linux commands so building on that is easy.
> 
> Because I know what the command line interface is. it is where you put the commands to write files or change permissions or install products like Zamfoo.




How do you update a server then so you can patch it in case of a exploit?


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## Aldryic C'boas (Jul 28, 2014)

MartinD said:


> See?
> 
> 
> Are you trolling or what? @Aldryic, we need you in here.


I would _LOVE_ to help.

*unzips*

Your best bet is to simply rent a small dedi and actually play around with virtualization, rather than diving into things headfirst.  There is a *HUGE* difference between relying on Solus (never a good idea), and actually knowing how _vzctl create_ and _virsh destroy_ work.

Before even considering trying to host others, you should be signing up for a few VMs of the virtualization type you wish to offer with various respected providers.  Play with those a few months, really get to learn how linux/BSD works.  You cannot _hope_ to offer support without knowing how things work on your own.  Once your comfortable, ask said providers if they would mind sharing a few tips on how they're able to provide quality service.

After all that - plan on having a single node, and just give out some VPSes to people you trust.  Run with that for awhile, get to know the actual pains behind managing a node.  Once you're at the point where you can fix most issues without having to run to a forum or Google?  THEN you can start saving your money, write up a proper business plan, and take the first small steps into commercial VPS hosting.


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## fisle (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> I know what CLI is now, you didn't tell me it was an acronym for something and what that freaking acronym was.
> 
> You know what. If you guys are just going to make fun of me/bring me down/tell me I am an idiot instead of doing what this forum says and bring me up and give me FUCKING ADVICE. Delete my account and this post and all of my other posts. I don't need to be apart of a community like this. Fucking assholes.



Stop being such a dick and maybe somebody will help you.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

fisle said:


> Stop being such a dick and maybe somebody will help you.


Please tell me how I am the dick.

I am requesting advice and so far only ONE FREAKING PERSON has given me legit advice. (thank you by the way, I'm reading it now).

The rest are just pointing out what I don't know and calling me arrogant.


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

Ugh, I just asked basic questions like do you know what a command line interface is?

On a side note, if you don't have a lot of experience with command line other then installing your app, then you should get to know it A LOT better. You will on occasion need to make massive changes to systems and diagnose issues that may arise.

http://linuxcommand.org/learning_the_shell.php


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

Twitter : https://twitter.com/DudeThatsErin/status/493855898193133568


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## Aldryic C'boas (Jul 28, 2014)

BTW - if you want to know why the community is reacting so harshly to you, read the following threads:











The kid that made those posts has been driving us _nuts_ with his 'pretend to be a real provider' crap.  And to be honest, you pretty much started off on the same foot as him - waltzed in, professed your inexperienced, and demanded that people help you (for free) so that you could start a business to make money from.  Nothing pisses off a professional administrator more than that, which we in this market refer to as a _dick move_.

That said.  If you want to be a host, the best place to start is by mastering VPSes as a client.  There are plenty of folks here (including those who have been taking the piss in this thread) who will gladly help you learn to manage a VPS on your own.  Get comfortable with that, and move on to a small dedi and providing VPSes for a few friends you trust.  Get comfortable with that, and _then_ your best course of action is applying for a temp/intern spot with an existing company.  Get a feel for how things are going to actually be, because I can guarantee you whatever your expectations are?  They're way off.

Get some experience under your belt, and you'll find that folks generally won't have an issue helping you get up on your feet.  But waltzing in and generally assuming that "being able to google things" makes you a sysadmin?  Yeah, that's just gonna piss people off.


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## Aldryic C'boas (Jul 28, 2014)

Mun said:


> Twitter : https://twitter.com/DudeThatsErin/status/493855898193133568


Well, I am a _pretentious_ asshole that makes great effort to know as much as possible... so I'll take that as a compliment


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

ohh god... http://erinnicole.nu/hello-world/

"I accidentally deleted my database so until I can remember what I posted my last blog about*"*


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## Mun (Jul 28, 2014)

@xxDriftingAway Actually, if you want to hit me up and talk feel free to PM me here.

Mun


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## Jack (Jul 28, 2014)

Aldryic C said:


> Your best bet is to simply rent a small dedi and actually play around with virtualization, rather than diving into things headfirst.  There is a *HUGE* difference between relying on Solus (never a good idea), and actually knowing how _vzctl create_ and _virsh destroy_ work.


I wouldn't even say you need a dedi, an old PC at home and slap CentOS on it would do the trick rather than actual outlaying unnecessary cost.


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## HalfEatenPie (Jul 28, 2014)

Yikes I came pretty late to the party.



xxDriftingAway said:


> Hello,
> 
> NOTE: My site may still be down, I was moving servers but intodns.com seems to show it is up & I can see it. I just wanted to state this before I go into anything. ALSO, I am not trying to advertise my site. I am simply asking for advice. THANK YOU!
> 
> ...


What @MartinD stated bluntly that I'll reiterate in a more friendly term is that there are a ton of people who assume slapping cPanel on a VM and getting WHMCS (or in your case IPB) to automate payment as a way to start a "company".

Most of the people who have commented on here are incredibly talented and have a wealth of knowledge available to those who ask in a manner different to... this. It's like walking into the local Deli and saying "I can also cut things so I'm going to open my own shop! But first can you tell me how to do everything?" This is a place where everyone (especially those who work 100% full-time in this industry) come to hang out, and what you basically did was kick open the door and yell out "I'm just like you guys!"

1. Your startup funds are pretty lacking. I mean this part I will be a pretty pretentious individual and state that you need to look into investing more of your money. Take a single business class and you'll know you need to make investments first (time, money, life, etc.) before you'll get a return on it (profit). In addition, the quality of said products comes into question as well. If you're going for the cheapest reseller plan to slab your "clients" on then you're gonna have a bad time (we get these posts about "so and so suddenly shut off their servers because they couldn't pay for it anymore! All my clients lost their data!" ... etc. every once in a while). Technically I'd say go for WHMCS and/or other licenses, it's easier to stay constant to one proven solution than to move everything over by hand.

1.1. Adding on to 1, your clients are there to receive a service they paid for, not be part of a forum. That's tacky and unprofessional. Actually invest in WHMCS or Blesta or Hostbill or some solution that makes it look nice.

2. Learn how to use the Linux Command Line Interface (Bash). Clicking buttons and looking at webpages is all easy but when shit hits the fan, you're going to probably have to use CLI to fix everything. Google is incredibly useful for helping you out, but I wouldn't bank on that when your butt is on the line.

3. You're exchanging cash for a service that you don't know how to provide (you've stated it yourself with "I don't know linux commands"). This is the "insulting" part for the rest of us. But ignoring that, follow the recommendations of several members here and start as a client first. Learn how to run everything. Actually know the in-depth differences and the changes between KVM, Xen, and OpenVZ (or other virtualizations you want). Know what situations causes what problems. Basically, be the guys who answers the questions on those Google search instead of the guy asking it.

4. Learn how to take a hit. Clients will annoy you. Some of the support tickets will try to push the boundaries of your patience. People (like the above) will yell at you for asking it wrong (example, this post). Most won't hold it against you for screwing up like this once or twice as long as you get the message, but repeated mistakes will have people avoid you like the plague.

4.1. Seriously, some people will try to push the boundaries and try to deceive you. You have to learn how to take a hit, cool down, and just let it go. Or be like @MartinD and @Aldryic C'boas and become the resident assholes (love ya guys). Quite often you need to be an asshole.

5. Don't be afraid to ask questions. But then again don't ask questions that you should know the answers to (you don't want your doctor asking you how to do surgery now do ya?).

I hope I got you a decent understand of what to expect. I mean my overall recommendation is to not start your host yet and to get more experience and understand more of what you're working with before actually taking good people's money to provide a service. In this industry everyone has the opportunity to call themselves "professionals" and "CEOs" and "Director of Marketing" without actually showing that they are a professional who knows what they're doing. What's even worse is that we can smell them do this a mile away, and any serious individual will probably stay away.

Oh and one thing that actually does annoy me everytime I see it. (This is gonna be pretty dickish here). You're not an engineer. An engineer is an actual license you need to take an exam for and have experience for. It's a license recognized and maintained by the local government or an actual entity that's generally recognized for providing said licenses. I understand the terms changes here and there but as an individual with an engineering license it's one of those pet peeves that annoys me and takes (in my opinion) the true meaning of being an engineer away.

Good luck, but please don't be a summer host.

*Edit:* I forgot to add. I'm 22. I'm the similar age you are. Don't put any blame on our young age. Any mistakes you do is yours. Own up to it. Realize what went wrong. Fix it.


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## raindog308 (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> 2) What do you think of me redirecting people to my forum to register and pay for the plan?
> 
> I am planning to be moving IP.Nexus (http://invisionpower.com) from my forum to my hosting site with IPS4 as long as they give us that option. If they don't, I will make other arrangements. I'd just rather not pay $15/mo for WHMCS when I have a fully licensed (legally I might add) IP.Nexus that can process payments and pay for hosting just fine.
> 
> BUT I am also thinking about just using xenforo but only if I can sell my IPB license.


In the next iteration of IPB (4.0, coming soon-ish) you could buy IP.Nexus without buying IP.Board.

That said, IP.Nexus doesn't support Solus natively, though you could code it.  My experience with Nexus is that it was written to support (a) help customers sell stuff shopping-cart style and (b) help people who want to use it for hosting.  But (b) is really "Nexus modules we wrote to sell hosted IP.Board and they'll probably work for you".  Invision has not really gone after WHMCS.

You should really run the 3-year cost of IP.Nexus vs. WHMCS owned, including maintenance on both.


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## raindog308 (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> Is my website.


I think that template is every summer host's website these days.  Ugh.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

I am fixing my mistakes. I did not state that I already asked for advice over on the admin zone which is why I am asking for advice and then saying "I will not do this or that" because they already told me I shouldn't do this or that and what I should do with WHMCS and that kind of stuff.

https://theadminzone.com/posts/842692/

I did not realize I had not stated that in the original post and I did come off as snarky. Which is why when you guys started insulting me I was confused and upset. I didn't realize how I sounded.

@HalfEatenPie Cool!  Thanks for the advice. I do need more money. I will definitely save and heed your advice and wait it out before I start doing this.

@raindog308 I'm definitely not a summer host. I was in the past but I am changing that all with this new go at it. I hate summer hosts and can see why you and everyone else would want to prevent them. I wasn't trying to go after WHMCS, I'm just simply needing a way to take payments and support tickets in one and not waste the licensing money I paid for IP.Nexus. I've already paid IP.Nexus so a 3-year cost is $0 since I don't have to renew. Renewing is mainly for IP.Board + Core and to keep the spam stuff alive.

You don't "HAVE TO" renew with self-hosting.


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

I hope everyone can accept my apology. I will be deleting my tweet momentarily.

I am working so, it may take a few extra minutes.


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## HalfEatenPie (Jul 28, 2014)

xxDriftingAway said:


> I hope everyone can accept my apology. I will be deleting my tweet momentarily.
> 
> I am working so, it may take a few extra minutes.


Edited that post for ya man. You probably don't want to release where you work (at least yet  )



xxDriftingAway said:


> I am fixing my mistakes. I did not state that I already asked for advice over on the admin zone which is why I am asking for advice and then saying "I will not do this or that" because they already told me I shouldn't do this or that and what I should do with WHMCS and that kind of stuff.
> 
> https://theadminzone.com/posts/842692/
> 
> @HalfEatenPie Cool!  Thanks for the advice. I do need more money. I will definitely save and heed your advice and wait it out before I start doing this.


Nice. Just remember to take whatever anyone says with a grain of salt. Use proper reasoning and understand why that suggestion was given.



xxDriftingAway said:


> @raindog308 I'm definitely not a summer host. I was in the past but I am changing that all with this new go at it. I hate summer hosts and can see why you and everyone else would want to prevent them. I wasn't trying to go after WHMCS, I'm just simply needing a way to take payments and support tickets in one and not waste the licensing money I paid for IP.Nexus. I've already paid IP.Nexus so a 3-year cost is $0 since I don't have to renew. Renewing is mainly for IP.Board + Core and to keep the spam stuff alive.
> 
> You don't "HAVE TO" renew with self-hosting.


Usually I disagree with this logic of thinking. Mostly because you don't know if there will be some kind of an exploit that's fixed in the updated version of IP.Nexus that you didn't get because... well... you didn't update it. Then someone runs it on your systems and suddenly your client's data is out there on the internet.

Anyways that's usually my gripe/recommendation with software subscription plans. It's one of those "better not risk it".


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## DudeThatsErin (Jul 28, 2014)

HalfEatenPie said:


> Edited that post for ya man. You probably don't want to release where you work (at least yet  )
> 
> 
> Nice. Just remember to take whatever anyone says with a grain of salt. Use proper reasoning and understand why that suggestion was given.
> ...


Thanks! You are right.

Will do. 

That is very true... Well, it is $85 to renew every 6 months so $170 per year... hm.. WHMCS is $180 per year... only $10 more.


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## Otakumatic (Jul 28, 2014)

Usually, it's a *really, really *bad idea for someone to start a LEB provider without knowledge (believe me, I've tried before and it's a horrible idea). Just think about it, what if an issue with something comes up that isn't fixable by rebooting/remaking the VPS or whatever simple fix? Yeah, you're not gonna know how to fix it. Plus, many of the very successful VPS hosts own their hardware, as renting hardware is a really bad idea (what if the host goes bankrupt? what if you need more IPs at like, $2/mo per IP, when most big LEB hosts own their BGP block?) and shows how professional you are. This is why I am not putting my hand into the LEB market by myself.

Take their advice and PLAY AROUND with virtualization before diving into the LEB host pool.


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## DomainBop (Jul 28, 2014)

> I don't know linux commands though I learn fast so managing my own server shouldn't be a problem



Then you shouldn't even be thinking about starting a web hosting business until you learn them.

If you don't know Linux commands it is also safe to say (that like a lot of hosts) you also don't know the first thing about server security...and yet you want people to trust you with their data?

Advice: don't start a hosting business now because you're not ready and it is guaranteed to fail.  Spend a few years (yes, I said years) learning the business before you start your own business.  If you're going to start a business you also should have adequate startup capital to get you through the first 6 months-1 year....and contrary to what the average summer host thinks, there is more to running a hosting business than just "playing with servers" so you will also need business management/finance skills, marketing skills, and customer relations skills if you want to start a hosting business or any business.

time to throw in this link again: http://www.sba.gov/writing-business-plan


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## mtwiscool (Jul 28, 2014)

Hello,

You need to learn how to use a vps before you can offer one as your users will ask you for help and you will need to be able to help the or they are going to make some nasty threads.

And you need to get a calculator out and check your number 4 times to make sure it add's up.

The biggest thing is that you need the funds to run even without users as we do not want to see more deadpool.


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## Aldryic C'boas (Jul 28, 2014)

_And now we all pause to glance at each other in disbelief; wondering if we should take the piss out of such audacious flippantry, or just pool up money to bribe the judge with after the kid mysteriously drowns._


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## HalfEatenPie (Jul 28, 2014)

Aldryic C said:


> _And now we all pause to glance at each other in disbelief; wondering if we should take the piss out of such audacious flippantry, or just pool up money to bribe the judge with after the kid mysteriously drowns._


I am also in shock...


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## mojeda (Jul 29, 2014)

Is this the afterlife??? Is that possible?


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