# VPN - US based - No traffic logs is a lie?



## Chuck (Jun 6, 2014)

I have been heard people say how good this Private Internet Access, they rank basically #1 for VPNs that claim not to log.

https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/pages/slick-resetnet-sale

I do some research, found this article:

https://www.bestvpn.com/blog/6484/the-nsa-prism-scandal-and-how-vpn-can-and-cannot-help/

Beware US based VPN services

Faced with the sweeping powers afforded to government agencies (such as the NSA) by the post 9/11 Patriot Act, and to copyright enforcement bodies by legislation such as the Digital Millennium Copyright Act 1998 (DMCA), most US based VPN providers do not make any real pretence at protecting their customers privacy or identity.

A few, most prominently Private Internet Access, do claim to provide high levels of security by keeping no logs ‘whatsoever’, and by using shared IP addresses, which in theory makes identifying an individual user with any internet behaviour impossible. However, the following points should be considered:

All US VPN companies are subject to the Patriot Act, and if the NSA is able to monitor all data collected by the likes of Google, Microsoft and Facebook, then it would be foolish to assume they cannot, or do not, monitor the servers of VPN companies such as PIA (who as we noted have a high profile)
All VPN companies are subject to the Stored Communications Act (SCA)which can force a provider to keep logs on the activities named individuals without alerting them to the fact
All traffic that passes through the US communications backbone can be monitored, so any traffic that passes through a US server can, at least in theory, be monitored by the likes of the NSA. Although the contents of encrypted traffic will remain hidden, the NSA can collect metadata of a similar nature to that obtainable by ISPs.


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## ihatetonyy (Jun 7, 2014)

PIA's claims are catering towards people who want to get around pesky DMCA notices from using public torrent trackers. They're not going to go full Lavabit for $6.95/month.

Grabbing the latest episode of Looking won't make you the target of a National Security Letter - those are the type of people PIA is marketing themselves towards. They can defend themselves well enough against HBO by saying there aren't any logs, but no one can defend themselves when The Government comes knocking on your door bearing a gag order and a nice piece of interception equipment to put in your rack.

You're absolutely right: if you are going to be participating in activity that will get the FBI/NSA on you, you _definitely _shouldn't be using a VPN that has corporate roots in the US and you shouldn't be routing any of that sort of activity through a US VPN server.


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## Flapadar (Jun 7, 2014)

Think of it this way : who is going to allow themselves to be thrown under the bus for some child molester/carder/terrorist? 

Anyone who isn't one of the above will likely keep logs to protect themselves


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## Mun (Jun 7, 2014)

The NSA can't monitor Secure conections. It simply would take them too long to figure out the keys for the data.


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## GIANT_CRAB (Jun 7, 2014)

Mun said:


> The NSA can't monitor Secure conections. It simply would take them too long to figure out the keys for the data.


INSTALL MOAR BACKDOORS.


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## Nyr (Jun 8, 2014)

Answering to your question: yes, it is a lie, obviously. Simple as that.


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## wlanboy (Jun 9, 2014)

Well it is just about "cover your own ass" for the companies.

I am using VPN to have a secure connection to the internet, because I am not trusting open accessable hotels/airports wlans.


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## Nyr (Jun 9, 2014)

Not just about them. Promising not to keep logs on any commercial service isn't viable.


Also, even if you controlled all your equipment and hosted your own VPN, your upstream is going to have logs anyway.


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