GreenValueHost / GVH and HostNun banned for operating shill ring

[DomainBop]

Fact is, plans change on a daily basis.

 Fact is, less than 24 hours before this latest GVH press release that had both your name and Jonny's name on it,  you had assured everyone that Jonny wouldn't be selling VPS's.

Fact is, businesses that survive for the long term don't change their plans on a daily basis,and instead they engage in long term planning (and the fact that XFuse has been in business for 3 years  doesn't mean jack shit if it was making so little that  less than a year ago you had to resort to begging for handouts on forums).

. But the fact is I will get paid and if I don't, he goes under again. No worries on my part.

So, no worries on your part if his new batch of customers gets screwed when he inevitably goes under again?  It's really too bad that people didn't take that same "not give a fuck" attitude about you last year when you were begging for money like a bum on forums, because if they had taken the same attitude and not donated last year then the hosting industry (and most importantly, the customers who get screwed) wouldn't have to deal with your and Jonny's antics this year which would b a win, win for everyone.

I do think a ban of you from this community is still reasonable

I think it's reasonable because I really don't think Duke gives a fuck whether customers get screwed as long as he makes some money (which makes him a perfect partner for Jonny who has shown a similar attitude).

 

[drmike]

I'll bet $50 that Duke boots Jonny and axes the whole arrangement - if there is one - be it re-selling a dedi server. 

I cannot for the life of me see Duke giving that quote in the "Press Release".  That's not Duke.  That is Jonny's writing and him boosting his chicken feathers.  As-if the industry cares that a multiple time mess maker is returning to make more messes.

It just isn't worth mixing it up in any way with GVH/Jonny, even as a customer buying servers.  Sad to see Jonny destroying other folks businesses and reputations, sucking their equity out for his own $2 hijinks.

 

[zed]

I'm amused that you're blaming Jonny for Duke getting involved. Weren't you endorsing the shit out of this nonsense?

 

[drmike]

I'm amused that you're blaming Jonny for Duke getting involved. Weren't you endorsing the shit out of this nonsense?

Thank you, been waiting for someone to step up and go there

This nonsense of GVH offering VPS, no I don't endorse that --- rather - GVH being out of VPS was the general idea.  This is recent whatever and not supposed to be.  Inconsistent with prior talks and all of what people were agreeable to then.

Anything that Jonny can manipulate and mass oversell he does so to the degree of criminal stupidity.  He can't do that with a dedicated server and why he should stick to selling those.

 

[drmike]

Cross posted from LET, Duke posted just a few minutes ago:
http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/50169/gvh-relaunching-again/p2
 

Transparency? The deal was made in private and most of it was discussed on here. I don't take anything on LET personally. People on here will talk as much as they can to make themselves look better. Jonny was banned again today. No one really will miss him. Lol. So since people want to talk, here we go.
Jonny owes a lot of money to CC and HVH for his past stupidity. I agreed that he could sell Xen and Dedis on a trial basis to help pay that back. Knowing that his past stupid would come back I made some stipulations that were being worked out. One was to stop posting stupid shit offers. Second was to eliminate the 1 Year Money Back Guarantee. Basically I'd work with him on pricing. He doesn't pay me, he gets suspended. Nothing michevious or anything like that. I know some of you want it to be shady and such but it isn't. I cannot effectively kill off GVH as a company unless I have grounds to. He has a few options here. First one is work with me and go legit with things as I'll be the all watching eye of sorts. Second one is go off on his own and continue his stupidity with Xen VPS only. Third is to go on with what he is doing and never learn anything.
Which option would you guys take? I rather see him gone completely. I cannot make that happen until I have better leverage. I can keep him out of vps and dedi sales sure, but is that really enough? Why doesn't the kid get a chance to learn better and proper ways of pricing?
This is the sad part about communities like this with people who think they know everything. They tend to talk and speculate and trash names without knowing the truth. Sad. But you guys say what you want and speculate to your hearts content. At the end of the day, I'll do what's best for myself, my business and my family. I likely have the only family owned company on LET. Ha...
Either way, nothing shady going on. Just trying to legitimize or kill GVH as a whole. Can't kill something you can't control, right?

I'll bet $50 $100 that Duke boots Jonny and axes the whole arrangement - if there is one - be it re-selling a dedi server [to Jonny]. 

 

[DomainBop]

VPSBoard:

Alright, so if you read the "press release" (lol) you'd know that Jonny wants to start selling VPS and Dedicateds. I allowed it for 2 reasons.1) Jonny owes me money. 2) He is buying servers from me. The fact that he is buying servers from me is very simple. If he buys them from me, he's paying for them monthly. If he doesn't, he gets suspended.

LET:

Jonny owes a lot of money to CC and HVH for his past stupidity. I agreed that he could sell Xen and Dedis on a trial basis to help pay that back

So in the space of the few hours between those posts the story has changed from "I'm letting him sell VPS because Jonny owes me a lot of money" to "I'm letting him sell VPS because he owes CC and HVH a lot of money"

Which is it?  He owes you or he owes CC?

If he is buying servers from a reseller (like you) and reselling them the margins are going to be lower then if he eliminated the middle man reseller (you) and  bought directly from the source (ColoCrossing/HVH...the people he owes money to).  If he is buying servers from you instead of directly from CC and doesn't pay you (who are nothing but a reseller) then doesn't that leave you owing CC/HVH for the server you rented from them and resold to Jonny?

I will say it is nice that you seem to show more concern for CC getting paid back what GVH Inc owes them than you have shown for the customers.

 

[drmike]

Me earning more public lashings....

VPSBoard:

1. Which is it?  He owes you or he owes CC?

2. If he is buying servers from a reseller (like you) and reselling them the margins are going to be lower then if he eliminated the middle man reseller (you) and  bought directly from the source (ColoCrossing/HVH...the people he owes money to).  If he is buying servers from you instead of directly from CC and doesn't pay you (who are nothing but a reseller) then doesn't that leave you owing CC/HVH for the server you rented from them and resold to Jonny?

3. I will say it is nice that you seem to show more concern for CC getting paid back what GVH Inc owes them than you have shown for the customers.

1. I think everyone in CC land is confused about who owes what.  CC as the end provider just wants paid.  They don't care who they have to intimidate to get their money.  Odds are debts to them are being gone after both parties as where before they were probably applied to whoever was on the account.

2. I have a feeling HVH / CC / etc. won't sell to Jonny at this point as unpaid bills relative to this matter.  So that has him dealing with resellers downstream like Xfuse.

3. That's a bit unfair.  I don't think Duke cares less about customers than CC.   Customers are everyone's focus in business and Duke hasn't proven to mistreat customers anywhere near degree GVH did in past.  If anything it has otherwise been VERY quiet in the land of Xfuse with regard to former GVH customers - except: Xfuse emailing customers promo and ahh this insane Jonny is back to selling "de-press release" (which isn't customer impactful).

 

[zed]

gvhxfs_drmike

 

[drmike]

... and I realize I used or probably misused the word intimidate.  It's applicable in situation in so far as if you owe a provider money they can rightly go threatening to offline your services/servers/etc.  Don't want that to be read that CC/related are rough housing those involved in this instance.  That isn't happening.  Quite the contrary.

 

[souen]

I've been following the chain of events (quietly until now) and having mixed sentiments about it.

Sorry, like Francisco I'm trying for the benefit of the doubt, but ... it's quite the mess. Not long ago the word was adamantly "no more selling VPS", today the rep announces relaunch with VPS. There were a lot of questions about the sale to begin with and the "plans change on a daily base" makes the whole situation lose even more credibility.  Setups change and agility is often considered a business advantage, but having a business plan change like the weather makes people question a company's reliability, e.g. what if they order service and it changes next week? How can potential customers trust the company to provide uninterrupted service for the long haul?

Before it was helping a fellow provider start anew and back on track, then it's "I'd rather see him gone completely". The contradictions aren't helping the cause. What company doesn't research another company's background before jumping in on an acquisition deal?

Here's a random thought: when there are major business changes, have the more reputable party issue the announcement first instead of the other party in trouble, given the tendency for one side to turn it into a PR disaster and/or ends with one apologising for the other's deeds. It shows lack of communication and coordination, and looks poorly for both parties. Shifting the blame around (e.g. I told him not to do that and he did it anyway) isn't going to change that. After all, if they cannot work together on something so simple, how much confidence will customers have in the support role if they order from one company and later need support provided by the other company?

tl;dr: the situation is unsound, not surprisingly people are sceptical. Good luck with resolution!

 

[host4go]

Cross posted from LET, Duke posted just a few minutes ago:

http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/50169/gvh-relaunching-again/p2

I'll bet $50 $100 that Duke boots Jonny and axes the whole arrangement - if there is one - be it re-selling a dedi server [to Jonny]. 

Honestely that kind of post by Duke doesn't reflect good on him. I find it amazing that you guys been able to diferenciate Duke from Jonny after readind his post since the whatever agreeement they were supposed to have made a while ago.

TLDR: Duke wants to make money. Everything else is BS to entertain the forums.

 

[Francisco]

So in the space of the few hours between those posts the story has changed from "I'm letting him sell VPS because Jonny owes me a lot of money" to "I'm letting him sell VPS because he owes CC and HVH a lot of money"

Which is it?  He owes you or he owes CC?

To be honest I think the debt is tied to GVH and not any one person. I get the feeling that Duke went to Jonny and said "You are going to help pay this down or ill walk and youre going to have to surgically remove Lance's dick from your ass". While Jonny is including the Brookyln Bridge with every sale, I doubt he's going to clear enough to pay down his total dues in 6 months + his current operating costs + his personal expenses.

You seem to be forgetting something, or in this case, someone. Jonny mentally needs GVH to live past this buy out. He has a very first year Chris mentality of "even my shits worth gold", but even the VPS king himself is humble in his dealings now and realized that his price wars didn't help anyone expect Biloh maybe.

Could you imagine how hard Jonny would drink if his first company went bankrupt? For his own health, he needs to at the very least break even on the deal (since I'm sure he had a pay cheque during his run as C*O), or it's going to kill him.

Cross posted from LET, Duke posted just a few minutes ago:

http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/50169/gvh-relaunching-again/p2

I'll bet $50 $100 that Duke boots Jonny and axes the whole arrangement - if there is one - be it re-selling a dedi server [to Jonny]. 

Pay it out to dudemann in pizzas.

1. I think everyone in CC land is confused about who owes what.  CC as the end provider just wants paid.  They don't care who they have to intimidate to get their money.  Odds are debts to them are being gone after both parties as where before they were probably applied to whoever was on the account.

2. I have a feeling HVH / CC / etc. won't sell to Jonny at this point as unpaid bills relative to this matter.  So that has him dealing with resellers downstream like Xfuse.

I highly doubt Biloh would be willynilly for accounting on one of his most vocal customers that he knows was selling unsustainable offers. Jonny already said (in public) with his old sell off of shared that it was unsustainable and that he had no choice but to sell or he'd go under. He said the same thing when he left the nest to move to quadranet/etc and ran up huge due bills there - he had no choice but to move back to CC or he couldn't cover his bills. This was all documented on one of the forums, I just don't care enough to go dig it up.

Honestly? Biloh should've gone to Lance, tell him he owes the debt in full now or they transfer ownership of all the dedicated clients at the very least. I wouldn't have counted Duke or Jonny in the mix since neither of them are on the ownership papers and given Lance is rarely ever talked to or ever heard from, I highly doubt the C*O rolls were ever assigned properly within the organization.

I feel bad for Biloh & co because they have to deal with this bullshit, but it's 100% their fault as well. They should've dealt with the zoo being in town when it started, instead of at the end and go "aw man their's piles of shit everywhere".

Francisco

 

[drmike]

Could you imagine how hard Jonny would drink if his first company went bankrupt? For his own health, he needs to at the very least break even on the deal (since I'm sure he had a pay cheque during his run as C*O), or it's going to kill him.

That's already happened... probably multiple pasted examples of his minor age substance abuse out there.

surgically remove Lance's dick from your ass. 

Lance-r the Friendly Ghost, that dick won't have anyone feeling a thing.  While a real guy, he isn't involved and hasn't been.  He is Jonny's beard.  Older kid filling out paperwork blindly for some kid he knew back there when they played [name that game] together.

Whole GVH won't die thing is all Jonny's ego. PERIOD.  Blood on his  pants, figure out time and place in life little girl type stuff.  You'd be hard pressed to find anyone in the debt pool and related shit that hasn't told Jonny 50x or more to fold GVH LLC up and move on.   That's where debts go to die, KID.

This is the part of the show where the entire viewing audience sighs in relief as Jonny gets ties cut, Biloh says FUCK OFF, GVH says not dealing with you and Duke says 'I am done being nice and being group abused for your antics Jonny'.

It is NEVER too late for anyone to stir up the Lance pot.  That's the guy responsible, who incorporated, etc.  Surely, faced with outcome and IOUs he'd just fold that LLC up and walk.

Too much rope given to Jonny to hang himself.... all this time...  This stuff isn't schoolboy playground stuff.  He burns up lots of productive folks time.  All the theater is about him acting like an adult when it benefits him and acting like a tweenager the rest of the time thinking it's entertaining.  It's about paving his pocket with cash and hell be it to customers, employees and everyone else.  Smug little fucker living in uppityville but fleecing hard working people all over with bullshit as a service. 

I have ZERO left for the kid.  He could fuck up a one car parade.  Biloh should go after his parents for the cash.  They enable the kid. They aren't playing parental roles right whatsoever.

 

[Francisco]

I dunno, I think CC should've just gone for the throat and be done with it. If they're this much of a headache externally, imagine what it must be like for them and they're due serious payments.

The debt gets cleared and CC removes a serious source of drama for them. They'll still have to accept they're "paying" for the brand in the form of the debt clearing, but really, CC's in full control here. Neither Jonny or Duke can move the brand because any funny business with that will end up with CC likely doing a total lock down "pay in full by bank transfer (not paypal, CC) and your suspension will be lifted".

Duke is hopefully still in a position where the most he's out is his time and not actual pocket cash.

Don't get me wrong here, I think Jonny's a nice kid, he's just way over his head and trying to 'make it big' while trying to also pass his classes. If he stuck to his original business plan of truly sustainable plans (and no, a business model requiring a node be 100% sold out with heavy ballooning/oversell to be profitable isn't sustainable), he'd have a much smaller operation that he could handle on his own and be putting away enough to cover his after school antics.

Francisco

 

[raindog308]

Jonny already said (in public) with his old sell off of shared that it was unsustainable and that he had no choice but to sell or he'd go under. 

I can't imagine why...

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=1472027

• Unlimited SSD disk
• Unlimited bandwidth
• Free SSL cert
• One year money back guarantee
• 49 cents a month

That offer was posted 4/14/2015.

 

[Francisco]

I can't imagine why...

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=1472027

• Unlimited SSD disk
• Unlimited bandwidth
• Free SSL cert
• One year money back guarantee
• 49 cents a month

That offer was posted 4/14/2015.

No no, this is shared attempt #3? #4? #5?? I'm talking about his very first one where he offloaded the customers on HVH.

Francisco

 

[drmike]

1. I dunno, I think CC should've just gone for the throat and be done with it. If they're this much of a headache externally, imagine what it must be like for them and they're due serious payments.


2. The debt gets cleared and CC removes a serious source of drama for them. They'll still have to accept they're "paying" for the brand in the form of the debt clearing, but really, CC's in full control here. Neither Jonny or Duke can move the brand because any funny business with that will end up with CC likely doing a total lock down "pay in full by bank transfer (not paypal, CC) and your suspension will be lifted".


3. Duke is hopefully still in a position where the most he's out is his time and not actual pocket cash.


4. Don't get me wrong here, I think Jonny's a nice kid, he's just way over his head and trying to 'make it big' while trying to also pass his classes. If he stuck to his original business plan of truly sustainable plans (and no, a business model requiring a node be 100% sold out with heavy ballooning/oversell to be profitable isn't sustainable), he'd have a much smaller operation that he could handle on his own and be putting away enough to cover his after school antics.

1. CC should do what businesses do and drop the hammer where it needs to be dropped.  IOUs aren't months on end and bad debt has limits.

2. CC doesn't want dramas- not even on LET.  These issues drive customers away from them and make it look more like a dysfunctional daycare.

3. Duke's situation I am not clear or privy to.  But, the personal and emotional toll such crap takes on most folks is just too damn much.  People bail under far less stress and while being compensated real living wages.

4. Jonny is young, idealistic and more egotistical than a bull with 200 pounds of nuts.  Insecurity.  He has his moments when 17 year old bullshit lizard brain meets white sugar crack mode gets tired.   As I say too much in my head, he gives first generation Asians a bad name.  He's capable, but so are a lot of other folks who would hinge onto the technology and learn in all this time.  

Jonny conflicts me mentally.  Some days I want to slap his parents in the mugs for not tending to their little Jonny Trump.  Some of the drama along the way has been funny and I always stop short of neutering him, feeling bad for his mental well being and propensity towards going insane.

Unsure where all this going, but isn't going to be any GVH selling boxes or VPS on CC's network at this point.  Hair brained idea, whoever cooked it up and nodded yes needs bitched slapped.  I have a few backhands for them.

 

[Munzy]

I don't see why people keep coddling him, it is annoying. He has spewed oil around him and everyone keeps making sure that the fire won't catch ablaze, but maybe he needs to see what the blaze is like to understand what he is doing is wrong. I say let it burn, let it burn to the ground.

 

[drmike]

Hey, here's how screwed up it is:

I AM ROOTING FOR COLOCROSSING TO DO THE NECESSARY AND TAKE THE SITUATION AND CALL IN THE DEBT.  

People can't pay, well Colocrossing isn't your risk / venture funding.

 

[DomainBop]

3. Duke's situation I am not clear or privy to.  But, the personal and emotional toll such crap takes on most folks is just too damn much.  People bail under far less stress and while being compensated real living wages.

Well, let's see, a review of XFuse Solutions LLC's ability to bring in money over the years raises the question of how in the hell Xfuse suddenly has the resources to rescue heavily indebted companies like GVH

mid-2013: Twitter: Xfuse owner posts on his Twitter page that he doesn't have any money coming in to feed his kids or pay his bills

mid-2014: Xfuse owner embarks on a public begging campaign on multiple sites including a "CenturyLink sucks" consumer complaint Facebook page he runs, and on every webhosting forum known to man, asking other people to donate money so he can feed his kids and pay his bills

early 2015: less than 6 months after the public begging campaign, Xfuse and its owner is suddenly a picture of financial stability and allegedly able to acquire heavily indebted companies assets

1. CC should do what businesses do and drop the hammer where it needs to be dropped.  IOUs aren't months on end and bad debt has limits.

For all anyone knows they could have dropped the hammer on GVH a couple of months ago similar to the way they dropped it on HVH a couple of years ago and they have their man from Louisiana doing cleanup and playing the public saviour while they try to keep their role hidden again.  Neither the habitual liar school kid in NH or the guy from Louisiana are exactly the most credible source of information, and anything they post on forums or in their psuedo-press releases should be taken with a grain of salt.

I don't see why people keep coddling him, it is annoying.

I don't see why people are trying to place all of the blame for this latest situation on Jonny.  Both Jonny and Xfuse share the blame for recent events and neither has been the picture of professionalism during this "Xfuse acquires GVH customers" popcorn fest.  Neither one of their companies  would be on my shortlist of hosts I'd trust my data to.