GreenValueHost outsources customer support to India.
- Thread starter drmike
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GVH-Jon
Banned
We follow their business model on our dedicated server sales and that's quite evident. As to their general business model in relations to public appearance, public relations, confidentiality, closed-book policy, etc, that's not us.
Hmm.....
Under what circumstance does a "relationship" with "just your upstream" have to remain "confidential"? No twisting anything, flat screen caps from a conversation you had with me via IRC.
You seemed to ignore the comment about Ernie having access to your WHMCS. "Just our upstream"
I'm all about businesses being honest and transparent, but I refuse to sit here and watch you say you are honest and transparent with your clients when it is a very obvious, blatant, flat out lie. Stop with the crap.
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GVH-Jon
Banned
The relationship that we have with HVH is primarily that we resell their dedicated servers and that they are our primary supplier of VPS nodes.
In regards to Ernie having access to our WHMCS, GreenValueHost receives large amounts of dedicated server orders and quick provisioning for dedicated servers is a necessity. As we resell bulk/large amounts of dedicated server orders from our upstream, HVH, I granted access for them to view our dedicated servers pending order queue for the sole purpose of quicker dedicated server provisioning.
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Aldryic C'boas
The Pony
The only thing I can find offensive in that is the generalization that, despite being a common assumption, outsourcing support means lower quality. Of course it can (and often will) mean this, but given that I can tie my own shoes I realize that a generalized statement does not hold for every possible match, and drmike is not making the claim that all outsourcing == poor quality.
I find "INDIANS. RUN!" about as offensive as being called a Russki, or a black friend telling me I don't understand Soul. And since apparently this needs clarification, s/offensive/amusing/.
I call BS, I've waited more than a week for my server.
drmike
100% Tier-1 Gogent
1. Can you say busted? You should get it lubed up good first. I hate friction. You did good on smoothly letting that sail.
3. Small cost?!?! You just got done bragging about employing Yankees [multiple times] and paying top dollar [in past two weeks].
2. We[2,3,?]Cares? No that's the Indian help desk monkeys.
3. Small cost?!?! You just got done bragging about employing Yankees [multiple times] and paying top dollar [in past two weeks].
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lbft
Active Member
While this is a good point, and there is an undercurrent of racism in the way some people talk about people from India, sometimes it's just people being awkward describing the real factors (language skills, culture clash and outsourcing to the lowest bidder). It's pretty hard to deny the pervasive negative idea of "outsourcing to India" includes those things.
Nobody thinks it's racist to hire a Chinese person to work on tickets for Chinese clients - they know the language and the business culture. Why is it necessarily racist to expect a company to hire people with native or near-native English? While Indian English is perfectly regular and a normal part of life for many people in India, it clashes with US/British/etc. English speakers' expectations. The same thing would happen with, say, Hong Kong English or Singlish.
There's also the fact that, when people talk about outsourcing to India, they usually mean outsourcing to the lowest bidder in India. So on top of language and cultural issues there's the issue that you're hiring people who can't find work for better pay, who on average are going to be worse at their jobs. There are plenty of good people who know their stuff and write more standard-by-US/UK-standards English in India - but even with the lower cost of living you're still not going to get them for the bottom-of-the-barrel pay that GVH is likely paying.
I'm going to just put my opinion here.
The only reason you or Earnie are getting "100TB" for $5/month is that you're nothing more than sales reps to CC.
Jon doesn't post his own sales on WHT anymore because he has Ernie handling all that and you running up the side lines with shared hosting.
Listen, answer me this. What changed that suddenly made it where you had to give all your shared customers up to Earnie,
yet you're now able to offer 100TB and 250GB space for $5/month? None of your shared customers were using that much.
Infact, you're right now selling "pure ssd cloud shared hosting" with unlimited resources.
What changed? I'll tell you what changed. You got in a bind and couldn't support your business, so like many, you sold to your upstream.
Now, maybe you really don't have direct CC dealings but HVH is owned and operated by CC. Why is this believed? Because Ernie owed CC quite a
few thousand in back invoices then suddenly he fired his best worker, stopped talking to them, and the debt allllll disappeared.
Kris on these forums has the full story if someone wants to bring him in here but he's gone into full detail a few times on here about it.
Francisco
The only reason you or Earnie are getting "100TB" for $5/month is that you're nothing more than sales reps to CC.
Jon doesn't post his own sales on WHT anymore because he has Ernie handling all that and you running up the side lines with shared hosting.
Listen, answer me this. What changed that suddenly made it where you had to give all your shared customers up to Earnie,
yet you're now able to offer 100TB and 250GB space for $5/month? None of your shared customers were using that much.
Infact, you're right now selling "pure ssd cloud shared hosting" with unlimited resources.
What changed? I'll tell you what changed. You got in a bind and couldn't support your business, so like many, you sold to your upstream.
Now, maybe you really don't have direct CC dealings but HVH is owned and operated by CC. Why is this believed? Because Ernie owed CC quite a
few thousand in back invoices then suddenly he fired his best worker, stopped talking to them, and the debt allllll disappeared.
Kris on these forums has the full story if someone wants to bring him in here but he's gone into full detail a few times on here about it.
Francisco
drmike
100% Tier-1 Gogent
"find "INDIANS. RUN!" about as offensive as being called a Russki, or a black friend telling me I don't understand Soul. And since apparently this needs clarification, s/offensive/amusing/."
Seriously, I want to believe GVH-Jon and ignore by basic math skills and not resort to pretend counting on my fingers. Shit doesn't add up.
How many times do I need to bust folks out of Buffalo telling stories?
Credit given, at least you didn't apply the Fabozzi school of logic and fessed up vs. continuing to lie.
If you were so proud of your Indian support staff, why no big press thing? I mean you are an active poster and all and have that active LET thread milking consumers or intending on? Guess Indian exploitation does sound appealing to customers? I bet you are paying them < $1k a month and I bet they are giving you multiple people around the clock.
You know who loves exploiting slave-like-labor --- Adam Ng / Kevin Hillstrand / Adam Jackson. This is his fingerprint.
Seriously, I want to believe GVH-Jon and ignore by basic math skills and not resort to pretend counting on my fingers. Shit doesn't add up.
How many times do I need to bust folks out of Buffalo telling stories?
Credit given, at least you didn't apply the Fabozzi school of logic and fessed up vs. continuing to lie.
If you were so proud of your Indian support staff, why no big press thing? I mean you are an active poster and all and have that active LET thread milking consumers or intending on? Guess Indian exploitation does sound appealing to customers? I bet you are paying them < $1k a month and I bet they are giving you multiple people around the clock.
You know who loves exploiting slave-like-labor --- Adam Ng / Kevin Hillstrand / Adam Jackson. This is his fingerprint.
Aldryic C'boas
The Pony
Outsourcing, and who is being outsourced to, isn't the issue. This is really only coming up because of how adamant the "we don't outsource" claims were prior, and has nothing to do with where it's contracted out to.
drmike
100% Tier-1 Gogent
I am multi-cultural. Multi-ethnic. Beyond that, my best friends are black, brown, Asian, etc. In fact, minimally white.
Saturday I went and ate Indian food at a new restaurant regionally. Go there every week, some times multiple times a week, cause you know I am a cracker devil.
You know what? I pay them what the food costs in the US of A. I don't pay them $1.15 for my lunch. That's my gripe.
Quit acting like the rest of the tech-exploiters that you are "helping" the those poor foreigners. And, especially quit blowing imaginary smoke about dropping big money paying them. I know what they cost over there. Heck I probably know the firm you are using.
I know someone dropping a whopping $700 a month for a team of Indians 24/7 for the very same support / niche / industry.
Son, you got played.For those interested in how much your 100TB VPS really costs GVH if you use your BW:
Personally I think a lot of what you're pasting is just to see how much of a leaky boat you are.
Why would Jon Biloh be telling Earnie that he has to pay for overages? Short of abuse or things breaking the TOS,
at no time should Jon be instructing Earnie how to handle "his" customers.
Of course, if GVH-Jon is being 100% truthful in this all, then Ernie has a lot of explaining to do.
Francisco
"Financial relationship"?
We already know HVH and CC have this special financial relationship, Jon said so himself on his forums. It only took one client here inquiring why Colocrossing was on their Hudson Valley Host credit card statement (and a couple months of denial) for them to admit this. But of course, 'financial relationship' could mean anything.
But if Jon oversees their finances, it's possible he'd have a say in things like that.
It could be true, it could be false. I could care less either way. I'd say there's a solid chance it is true being the financial relationship HVH and CC have, that would extend down into GVH as GVH "resells" HVH's servers, and gets all of their VPS nodes from HVH.
Not a whole lot of value attempting to see if I'm a leaky boat or not, I've made it very clear multiple times in the past that I will call CC and CO out as necessary.
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It really can't though. Legally they aren't allowed to broker another companies transactions like that unless they're designated as a bank and have direct MC/VISA agreements.
The only thing it means is that CC owns (or at least did own) them.
You need to realize, this isn't something small where CC would get slapped on the wrist with a simple account suspend and unsuspend when they fix things. Doing that crap is counted as money laundering and short of being the head of Bank of America, you aren't getting off the hook on a laundering charge.
Francisco
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