Incero Review - AVOID

Alec

New Member
Yeah, well that operation is a local utility that does everything in Springfield, right?  Telephone, electric, water, natural gas, and the public bus transportation.... right?
http://www.springnetunderground.net/

Not sure why you would want to go there though?

It's all going to be homed off MCI (Kansas City).  If I recall there may be some ring protection to STL.

Might as well just go to some place like http://caverntechnologies.com/ where you will have less latency than going down to Springfield.

In either instance you are in the $30 - $45/Mbps price range.

Most people are in the major markets because not only is it less expensive to operate but they have more connectivity options, and better interconnects, etc.
 

SeriesN

New Member
Verified Provider
http://www.springnetunderground.net/

Not sure why you would want to go there though?

It's all going to be homed off MCI (Kansas City).  If I recall there may be some ring protection to STL.

Might as well just go to some place like http://caverntechnologies.com/ where you will have less latency than going down to Springfield.

In either instance you are in the $30 - $45/Mbps price range.

Most people are in the major markets because not only is it less expensive to operate but they have more connectivity options, and better interconnects, etc.
Welcome to VPB boss.
 

SkylarM

Well-Known Member
Verified Provider
http://www.springnetunderground.net/

Not sure why you would want to go there though?

It's all going to be homed off MCI (Kansas City).  If I recall there may be some ring protection to STL.

Might as well just go to some place like http://caverntechnologies.com/ where you will have less latency than going down to Springfield.

In either instance you are in the $30 - $45/Mbps price range.

Most people are in the major markets because not only is it less expensive to operate but they have more connectivity options, and better interconnects, etc.
I just mentioned it because he said anything underground and it made me giggle a little. It's rather unfortunate as they are the only local provider within a decent range of my house ;(
 

SeriesN

New Member
Verified Provider
I said not many, I didn't say not any. OFC I know you're in NYC, for very good reason. But aside from you and DigitalOcean, what other low(er) end providers are there?
I love DO's control panel. There used to be more provider but since the day internap bought out voxel, well, it became really expensive and tbh we are not everyday Lowend provider :(. Can't keep with the big boss's like AlFran or KoolJOE!.
 
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Zach

New Member
Verified Provider
I thought expensive was why there weren't many providers in NYC?
There was a thread on WHT on why there weren't many service providers in the Boston area.  A friend of mine lives in Revere, MA and has contacted several service providers and received quotes like $500+ for single server colocation.
 

drmike

100% Tier-1 Gogent
In either instance you are in the $30 - $45/Mbps price range.
 

That's bone headed pricing.  Still looks like an interesting place :)  Just not the place for low end folks, who they'd probably not like anyways as customers.

It does take a special kind of datacenter to handle the mass IP requests, the abuse issues, the inevitable DDoS attacks and do so for essentially a price that can't even cover professional staff manning the help desk.
 

D. Strout

Resident IPv6 Proponent
AHAHAHAHAH! 
Not "idiot", but you get the idea :D Seriously, I wish NY/New England was more "densely populated" in terms of providers. I did a search just now on WHT for the thread Zach mentioned. IDK if I found the exact one, but I saw several that show me how expensive it is. Unfortunate :( When I become a millionaire I'll subsidize services there :)
 

Zach

New Member
Verified Provider
Not "idiot", but you get the idea :D Seriously, I wish NY/New England was more "densely populated" in terms of providers. I did a search just now on WHT for the thread Zach mentioned. IDK if I found the exact one, but I saw several that show me how expensive it is. Unfortunate :( When I become a millionaire I'll subsidize services there :)
Here ya go  ;)
 

SeriesN

New Member
Verified Provider
Not "idiot", but you get the idea :D Seriously, I wish NY/New England was more "densely populated" in terms of providers. I did a search just now on WHT for the thread Zach mentioned. IDK if I found the exact one, but I saw several that show me how expensive it is. Unfortunate :( When I become a millionaire I'll subsidize services there :)
I believe URPAD used to have nodes in voxel. 
 

Wintereise

New Member
>Who is/was Voxel? They can't have been that big, all I seem about them is press releases about how Internap bought them out.

Larger than 99% of the companies in their business-sphere.


Was a great provider to work with too, though, that's not to say that Internap is bad either. We have direct stuff with them and everything works the same way anyway.
 

gordonrp

New Member
Verified Provider
I've been a fan of the network at Corexchange.  Incero uses Corexchange's blend plus adds to it their own Cogent (Corexchange has Cogent in their blend already) and nLayer.  nLayer is kind of hit or miss for me elsewhere and blah.  The Corexchange blend is heavy on Level3,  Abovenet and NTT.   I'd take that network over most networks in the US.  Incero's usage seems to be 46% Cogent,  38% Corexchange and 15% nLayer, so very different that Corexchange house blend.
Oh dear, let me help here.   :)

If you get your information from bgp.he.net (as I assume you did) then you need to understand how that site works. It's basically a route collector. That is, it's looking up the routes from their location to our location. As Cogent is the most interconnected network in the world (most AS numbers connected) the cogent path INBOUND to us will appear more often across the internet when looking at possible routes. 

HOWEVER, the number of routes and route options inbound to a provider has nothing to do with which links the provider actually uses to send the data out to it's customers. 

For example, here is a screenshot of our current uplinks, the top graph for each link is a daily graph, the bottom graph is a weekly graph (BLUE IS OUT FROM US, GREEN IS IN TO US):



So we can see, on the weekly basis:

Corex 10gig uplink outbound 6gbit/second

Cogent 10gig uplink outbound 0gbit/second (NO TRAFFIC SENT OUT, used as failover)

Nlayer 20gig uplink outbound 13.2gbit/second 

=

40GBIT/SECOND CAPACITY, 19GBIT/SECOND USED, 21GBIT/SECOND SPARE, 0GBIT COGENT USED

So if you love Corex bandwidth, and you love Nlayer bandwidth, then we have the best of both worlds (plus some added redundancy). Our 20gig nlayer link is made up of 2x 10gig links going out diverse sides of the building, and out corex and cogent links also go out diverse sides from each other.

Our 40gig (2x 20gig via diverse sides and paths around Dallas) ZAYO/ABOVE.NET link is currently deploying and scheduled to turn up for customers on Sept 1st, bringing us to 80GIG. Then we will without a doubt have the best network offering out of most every provider in Dallas.

--------

As for shovehosts problems. I apologize for not being able to help him.

He was trying to scp (encrpytion) a file to another host with X latency, SCP will typically cap out over any non 5ms link at a crazy low rate. The correct way to test his link would be to use iperf. 

Giving us a download speedtest from softlayer showing good speeds, then an upload to them showing slow speeds just reminds me that they have those old ass pata drives in there writing at 10MB/second. If he had used the frostgaming speed test server or pushed/pulled to cachefly he would have reached full speeds. 

Ultimately we gave him an awesome deal, he said he was going to TEST THE SERVER FIRST (no clients) and then he became a version of R****t C***ke, but we're an unmanaged host for expert users only so I refunded him and cut him loose. Since then I've hired two additional staff to handle support from our datacenter office and will defer such tickets to them.

At some point hopefully we can setup an automated/self-service webpage that schedules an iperf from our network to someone's intended target, so they can test our network outbound without actually having to setup a server.

All customers can reach their 1gbit speeds outbound at any time. 

----------

xoxo

Gordon
 
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gordonrp

New Member
Verified Provider
3. Incero is probably not the best choice for people wanting a performance network.  To be frank, there is a rather embarassing thread on WebHostingTalk where he makes claims about nLayer which allegedly do not hold true.  Either way, it shows that his understanding of network engineering is less than it should be at the "running a DC" level.
Sorry, but you don't know anything about anything apparently. Nor do you know anything about the massive problems with nlayer recently. I confirmed the problems with Clint @ ubiquity and a few others who reached out to me and confirmed they had issues too.

http://d.pr/i/cRL4/1MMWdxJG  <--- South to N.E. backbone down, routes didn't auto update for several hours. 4 hour outage.

http://d.pr/i/cqgc/45lHEJwF  <--- packets through our 20gig link blamed to be the cause of problems across their west coast network. If any one single 20gig customer can supposedly impact their entire network then what is it, a bunch of tin cans and string? In reality what I believe happened was nlayer doesn't filter any of their customer ports AGAINST permitted announcements (EDIT: OUTBOUND TRAFFIC/AKA SPOOFED TRAFFIC). This summer an chinese gang has been working to build a large ddos network to attack various sites in China. Nlayer is the shortest route to china for most providers out of the US. Most high bandwidth providers use nlayer. Thus nlayer has a mass of pps attacks that were hard for them to see on their traffic management applications and resulted in a few weeks/months of performance degradation.

 

So I counter your comment about you calling me incompetent when you really don't know jack with:


 
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concerto49

New Member
Verified Provider
Can Incero confirm which Corexchange blend they are on? They have 2 blends. 1 that is with the full list of carriers and one that is reduced.
 

gordonrp

New Member
Verified Provider
Can Incero confirm which Corexchange blend they are on? They have 2 blends. 1 that is with the full list of carriers and one that is reduced.
Full but without Cogent, and always have been. However I believe they had pricing issues with above.net and they moved most of their Above.net traffic over to NTT and keep their above.net and level3 usage very low (gig or so), then they added cogent and HE. This is why we added nlayer and are adding zayo/above.net directly. When their network was mostly above.net it was better than it is today. We've expanded our network at just the right time.
 
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